TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

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Andy Velebil
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TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

Post by Andy Velebil »

Was at the offsite storage and found this. Recalling my last experience with it, I figured it was best to see if it was an off bottle. Decanted about 2 hours. This was simple, lacking any structure or complexity, and even though it had some fruit left that fruit was very "flat" tasting. As if when a can of Coke loses its carbonation. Other older vintages, like the 2001 and 2004, are still very good and holding nicely. This vintage is falling apart at the seams. Drink up as soon as possible.
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Brian C.
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Re: TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

Post by Brian C. »

Andy, do you think there is a dumb phase happening, or is this really the end of the line for this wine? I'm curious as to whether or not Douro reds close down like VP's do, and if there is good mature phase to be had after that.
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Re: TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

Post by Andy Velebil »

Brian C. wrote:Andy, do you think there is a dumb phase happening, or is this really the end of the line for this wine? I'm curious as to whether or not Douro reds close down like VP's do, and if there is good mature phase to be had after that.
I guess anything is possible. But I've yet to see a Douro wine shut down that badly. I certainly have not seen any vintage of this wine do so.

While I do think some Douro wines go through a patch, as do most upper end dry wines, I would say it's too early to come up with a rough guideline like Port. Dry wines in general tend to behave very differently from each other. So trying to come up with a generic one-size-fits-all may be very difficult. Guess time will tell.
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Brian C.
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Re: TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

Post by Brian C. »

Andy, I saw this happen with my bottles of 2003 Quinta dos Roques Reserva from the Dao a few years back. I caught this stuff in a very disjointed phase. As luck would have it, the last bottle showed signs of emerging life. I think the common thread between my experience and yours is that these were riper vintages? And as you suggest, the book has yet to be written on what happens with the Douro reds as they advance in age, and what they might have in common with VPs in this regard. I think back to when Roy told me it's the same grapes, so decanting is very necessary for the Douro reds as well. Perhaps that logic holds true for the dreaded dumb phase and thereafter as well? Maybe those who have experienced the wide range of Barca Velha vintages might have some insight on long range Douro red aging, as there aren't that many other examples?
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Re: TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

Post by Andy Velebil »

Brian C. wrote:Andy, I saw this happen with my bottles of 2003 Quinta dos Roques Reserva from the Dao a few years back. I caught this stuff in a very disjointed phase. As luck would have it, the last bottle showed signs of emerging life. I think the common thread between my experience and yours is that these were riper vintages? And as you suggest, the book has yet to be written on what happens with the Douro reds as they advance in age, and what they might have in common with VPs in this regard. I think back to when Roy told me it's the same grapes, so decanting is very necessary for the Douro reds as well. Perhaps that logic holds true for the dreaded dumb phase and thereafter as well? Maybe those who have experienced the wide range of Barca Velha vintages might have some insight on long range Douro red aging, as there aren't that many other examples?
True. I tend to decant most of my Douro wines. IME they tend to show far better with at least an hour or more of decanting, especially when young. Some are better with a good 4-6+ hours when young.

As for Barca Velha...I really enjoy them, but. And a big but...older ones are generally fully mature and ready to drink or past their best. The older ones, early 1990's and older that is, are pretty advanced when you compare them to wines from some other regions in the same age range. Are they worth the money they often command based on folk lore? IMO, no. That is a bit of a contrarian view I know and I'll argue it with anyone. IMO the newer vintage (2004 and forthcoming ones) will be far superior in the aging long term department. Dry wine making has come a LONG way since BV started and was the only top game in town, er, should I say the Douro.

That said...I do buy older ones when I find them at a good price that make it worth it, and as much newer ones as I can find, so I am not knocking BV all. I love BV! I'm just putting sentimental attachment aside and looking at it objectively. And in that regard older BV's really haven't lived up to the reputation they have.
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
Brian C.
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Re: TN: 2005 Chryseia Douro Red

Post by Brian C. »

Andy Velebil wrote:
Brian C. wrote:Andy, I saw this happen with my bottles of 2003 Quinta dos Roques Reserva from the Dao a few years back. I caught this stuff in a very disjointed phase. As luck would have it, the last bottle showed signs of emerging life. I think the common thread between my experience and yours is that these were riper vintages? And as you suggest, the book has yet to be written on what happens with the Douro reds as they advance in age, and what they might have in common with VPs in this regard. I think back to when Roy told me it's the same grapes, so decanting is very necessary for the Douro reds as well. Perhaps that logic holds true for the dreaded dumb phase and thereafter as well? Maybe those who have experienced the wide range of Barca Velha vintages might have some insight on long range Douro red aging, as there aren't that many other examples?
True. I tend to decant most of my Douro wines. IME they tend to show far better with at least an hour or more of decanting, especially when young. Some are better with a good 4-6+ hours when young.

As for Barca Velha...I really enjoy them, but. And a big but...older ones are generally fully mature and ready to drink or past their best. The older ones, early 1990's and older that is, are pretty advanced when you compare them to wines from some other regions in the same age range. Are they worth the money they often command based on folk lore? IMO, no. That is a bit of a contrarian view I know and I'll argue it with anyone. IMO the newer vintage (2004 and forthcoming ones) will be far superior in the aging long term department. Dry wine making has come a LONG way since BV started and was the only top game in town, er, should I say the Douro.

That said...I do buy older ones when I find them at a good price that make it worth it, and as much newer ones as I can find, so I am not knocking BV all. I love BV! I'm just putting sentimental attachment aside and looking at it objectively. And in that regard older BV's really haven't lived up to the reputation they have.
Have you tried any from the 1960s or even earlier than that? Some on Cellar Tracker seemed to have a good experience with them. I guess the other old timer in Portugal that comes to mind is the wines from the Bussaco (Bucaco?) Palace Hotel, though that's obviously not Douro, but has grapes you'd find in the Douro.
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