Port palate migration

[Roy Hersh]

In another thread here, in a response to my friend Alex, where I was commenting (as shared below) I had the idea for a fun thread. Please share how over the years, your Port drinking habits, or preferences have changed.

Here was what I wrote:
I'd say 98% of my first two decades of drinking were Vintage Ports. Tawnies on rare occasions back then, and Colheitas very rare.
Starting within a few years of our meeting, that began to change and by the end of that decade, I was still 60/40 VP dominant. Nowadays, and given my location ... and the inclusion of White Ports (Colheitas and 10 yo-100 years) the mix has shifted a LOT. VP is now only 35-40% of my consumption. Someday, if/when I regain control of my old cellar's contents, that will change again. But even on my tours in Douro, which began 90% VP, even those are now down to about 40% VP.

What about you? Is your Port consumption ruled by what you purchased earlier in life? Do you drink more or less Vintage Port than you once did? How about the ratio of Tawny to White Port and VP? I think it will be interesting to hear. You don't need to shy away from this topic, even if you have only been drinking Port, beginning in this half decade. Please do share ...

[Glenn E.]

I think there are actually 3 questions in there, all of them fun!

Consumption:

Last year marked 20 years of drinking Port for me. My first bottle was a 375 ml bottle of Porto Rocha 20 Year Old Tawny Port that I was given for my 40th birthday. For a few years, I really only drank Tawny Port. My consumption was so... abnormal... that Roy gave me the nickname "Mr. Tawny". (Lisa changed it to "Dr. Tawny" the first time that I visited DR on one of Roy's tours.) I really only began to slowly include Vintage Port (and the occasional LBV) into my drinking between 2010 and 2014, in part because I really wasn't sure which producers I liked and how old I liked my VP. As the years went by, my VP consumption slowly increased as a share of total consumption, to the point that these days I'm probably pretty close to 50:50 ruby vs wood-aged. And since White Port is now a thing, that means my consumption of Tawny Port has dropped quite a lot! I probably still drink more Tawny Port than White Port, though, so the total is probably something like 50:30:20 or maybe 40:35:25 representing VP:Tawny:White. That is likely skewed by the fact that a significant part of my consumption happens at Port Club now, and our group tends to bring a 50:50 mix of VP and wood-aged Port.

Cellar:

I originally bought and stored Tawny Ports like some crazy person. I wasn't aware at the time that they're not meant to be aged. I still think doing so is fine in many cases, but I've had enough "tired" Tawny Ports now that I'm trying to control my bad habit. As I started enjoying Vintage Port, that rapidly took over most of my cellar, but it's never really gotten higher than about 70% or maybe 75%. I still have a lot of Tawny and White Port on hand. But since one is actually supposed to age Vintage Port, that quickly becomes the largest part of one's cellar even if one is drinking as much or more wood aged Port. Tawnies and Whites cycle through faster... VP is bought and then kept for years and years before being opened.

Palate:

My palate has definitely changed over the years! I originally like 20 Year Old Tawny Port the best, with a mix of roughly 30 year old Colheitas thrown in for variety. That slowly drifted older (and older), to where now I'm most likely to grab a 40 YO to open on any random evening, or maybe a 30YO if I'm feeling like something slightly younger. I tend to drink blends far more often than Colheitas on my own, but I have a supply of very old Colheitas to bring to tastings. 30s and 40s are awesome with a nut & cheese course!

For Vintage Port, I originally liked them really old. Somewhere around 50-60 years old was great with 40 kind of serving as the younger side of my preference. I do still very much enjoy drinking old VP, but my preference now is for something that's 30-40 years old depending on the producer and vintage year. I like them solidly mature, but only just. Something from the 1980s if it's a primary producer from a generally declared year, or from the 1990s if it's a secondary producer or an off year. No longer boisterously fruity, but not yet completely secondary either.

White Ports are a much more recent thing. And while I do like a well-aged White Port, I generally prefer the younger end of the spectrum. 10 Year Old White Ports, or a Colheita Branco that's 12-20 years old. They're just so luscious and juicy! I'll drink sweet ones on their own, or something on the slightly drier side (but not a Dry White Port) if I'm going to have it with food. For me, at least, a 10 YO that's slightly drier goes well with the same food with which others might drink Champagne, a white wine, or even a Pinot Noir. By the time others are drinking Bordeaux or a California Cab, I need to switch to a VP or LBV. But try it some time - a slightly drier young White Port pairs well with a wide range of food!

[Lucas S]

I've only been drinking Port "seriously" for a couple of years, and my initial intention to explore Port was to buy as many LBVs as I could and try to do horizontals and get a feel for the house styles.

I have not given up on this concept, but the realization that I can buy good VP for $30-45 at auction changed my perspective - paying $25 retail in the US for LBVs has become slightly less appealing. Thus, I've been rapidly approaching a 45/45 split VP/LBV mix, with the other 10% being the occasional ruby reserve, tawny, and whites. That said, I don't think such low auction prices for VP are sustainable and do not expect such pricing to last, even acknowledging the broader wine market is in a slight down-tick at the moment.

I have noticed how LBVs are only ~$15 retail in Portugal so I have wondered about what "wholesale" or case pricing would be for them there, especially if bonded for export. I was thinking about asking if GWS would source and sell me "ready cases" of 12 different LBVs for horizontals. Especially since some brands of LBVs are not for sale in the US at all - Croft for example is a notable absence, but there are others such as Seara d'Ordens and Vieira de Sousa whose LBVs do not seem to be distributed. I have a feeling others would be interested in such "variety packs" as well. I would buy at least one, likely two, and possibly 3-4 such horizontal cases "every decent vintage year" if it would be possible to at least match US retail pricing, simply because of the variety of LBV Ports available only in Portugal. And, of course, a lot of these would be unfiltered and could be interesting to buy a full case for the long term.

[Eric Ifune]

I started drinking Vintage Port with my father, but not commonly. Later, I got into Madeira and thus got into wood aged Ports. Have been drinking mainly Tawnies and Colheitas for the past 25-30 years. Later, maybe 15 years ago, Roy introduced me to aged whites. Even more Madeira-like. Now, I'd say my consumption is 50% wood aged, 25% VP's, and 25% aged whites.

[Moses Botbol]

I am drinking newer vintages more often than I did 15-20 years ago. I would have never thought to drink a vintage port under 25 years old back then but do pretty regularly now. 1970 and older vintages languish in the cellar waiting for an event or guest.

Nights where we drink 1.5-2 bottles of port each are 2-3 times a year rather than monthly.

Using the customized placemats have been swapped for a Sharpie marking the port glasses. Haven't gone over 3 bottles of port being served at once in a long time.

Preference for drier ports has grown larger.

[Frederick Blais]

I'm mostly drinking wood age Port as it is more available. Here in Portugal, and when I was in Canada, aged Vintage Port are just not price properly in comparaison to the market. Else I think I would drink definitively more Vintage. For me Vintage rings more with a special occasion while the wood aged Port are great for a daily companion.

I am not surprised that sales of Tawny are climbing, this is just a reflection of the society. We can't wait, we are impatient to get instant reward....so we want something that is ready NOW!

Also, with the fame of Whisky, wood aged Port connects easily with them. I'd say that 50% of the customers who try a Tawny for the first time says it tastes like Whisky...

[Al B.]

Like Fred, I'm drinking a lot more tawny and white because they are just great for daily consumption - as I write this, I'm sipping on Messias 20YO White. No need to decant, this was opened and poured about 10 minutes ago.

I looked back at my notes on the Ports I drank in 2006, the year I joined Roy in the lagars at Vesuvio. 95% of the bottles were VP or SQVP, 3% were LBV or Crusted and 2% colheitas. I tasted no Tawny Port and had no idea what White Port was that year.

Boy how things have changed! Last year that was really turned upside down. Only 55% of what I tasted were VP or SQVP, just under 10% were other kinds of ruby (ruby / ruby reserve / LBV / crusted), 26% was tawny or colheita and the remaining 9% was white Port. I even managed a couple of bottles of Pink Port, a garrafeira and a quinado!

The average age of the bottle matured Port I drink has probably got older as my cellar has got older. I prefer to open VPs from 1970 or older although the average age of the VP I open works out to be 52.

[Eric Menchen]

Glenn broke this down into consumption, cellar, and palate. I'll start with cellar, because that's an easy one. The cellar is:

• 92% VP
• 4% Tawny
• 2% Colheita
• <1% White
• 1% LBV
• <1% Crusted

That's a reflection of the fact I still love to drink VP, but also because those are the wines to buy and age. I might have enough VP to drink until I'm dead. But I only have a few years of tawny and colheita, and I'll buy more as those are consumed.

As for consumption and palate, my guess would be that I tasted slightly more VP than the rest combined. Maybe 55% VP, 40% tawny+colheita, 5% other? The tour with Glenn certainly helped bump up the tawny and colheita categories. I would like to drink a little more VP than the rest, probably more than 55%, but that doesn't seem so practical. I can open some VPs at an organized dinner, but the tawnies and colheitas are more versatile for occasions when a full bottle won't get finished. Those wood aged Ports also seem to better received by some friends that might not be into wine so much. I did recently purchase a few more 375ml VPs, so I might get to open more of those this year.

[Mark L]

I have very much enjoyed reading everyone's "evolutions of palate" and thought I'd contribute mine, as my journey seems to be somewhat different than others.

I started from the White Port side of the spectrum. Technically, my first enjoyable white wine was a Sauternes, though it was -- at the time, my senior year in college -- a tad sweet for my taste, but still delicious. About 7 or 8 years later, my wife and I spent part of our honeymoon in Portugal (the last stop of an Around the World in 30 days trip courtesy of accumulated airline miles), and discovered our love for white ports, which seemed to be a perfect balance of sweetness and acidity for us at the time. I do not remember exactly what producer we had, but I can tell you that it was an offering from the restaurant within the Pousada do Castelo de Obidos where we stayed. We ended up purchasing several bottles of white port to bring back with us.

Knowing a thing or two (literally, only one thing or maaaaaybe two) about port as compared to my peers, I often gifted a 10- 20- or 30- tawny for friends, and we would enjoy them together, but my own personal enjoyment was still dedicated to white ports even though they were ridiculously hard to find wherever I was looking (local liquor stores only).

Then (in 2010?) Taylor Fladgate came out with the Scion, and they held some tastings around my area, to which I was kindly invited. Tasting something from 1855 blew my mind wide open, and the liquid was still "fresh" in ways I previously thought impossible. It was not long (perhaps only days) before I found ancient madeira, Mannie, then Roy, then ... well, my palate is still squarely on Madeira and (now more aged) white port. Of the older white ports, I tend to gravitate toward those that are less raisin-like and more honey-like. 30 yr white is a great place for me, though perhaps my favorite of all time is the 60 S. Leonardo -- even more so than their 100.

I only have probably a case or so of VP in my cellar - probably mostly TF and some Fonseca, as well as a couple bottles of unmarked VP Port that was estimated to come from the mid-late 1800s or thereabouts... (I would love to open these up with some local (to Los Angeles) Port enthusiasts one day! )

I will admit that I do not consume anywhere near the same rate I once was, and so if I stopped buying I would have enough to last two lifetimes. I decided a couple years back that I was not consuming enough to enjoy the ups and downs and complex journeys of good bottles and less-good bottles. And so I decided to try to fill my cellar with juice that would simply outlive me, that would stand the test of time reliably, and would -- more likely than not -- provide a fairly predictable drinking experience long into the future. As such, most value in my cellar comes from ancient madeira: the cellar defenders being a few cases of 1964 and 1954 VJHs, and the prized possessions being of much older origins. I'm not sure what they're defending, though, nor what I'm waiting for -- I should just open those babies up and enjoy them. (I also have some favorite whiskeys which, while not as rare, should also hold up)

Times like these LA fires where dear friends lost everything (and were left with only "memories") that make me realize I should enjoy them when I can and not wait. At least then, I can at least carry with me the MEMORY of having had them. I'm only one natural disaster away from missing out entirely, not even having had the chance to make a memory to hold on to.

Drink up, me 'earties, Yo ho!

Cheers,
Mark
Los Angeles, CA
(Oak Park, CA to be more specific)

** EDIT: I just realized that this was posted in the PORT side of the forum, in which case I should note that aside from my madeira, I've got more White port than VP (probably 2x to 3x), and a handful of old Niepoort Colheitas I should also drink!

[Edward J]

Interesting topic because we have migrated our Port drinking and buying.

The cellar contains: 75% VP, no additions planned as at our current consumption, the VP's will outlast me. No new additions planned.
25% Wood aged Port. These Ports are now 75% of our consumption and are purchased on a regular basis.

We still love VP, but it is a bit to open and serve. Many of our guests won't drink it except to taste. When we open a tawny(or Colheita), it's pop n pour! Our guests are more eager to taste, try, drink and then ask where can we get some of this? The amount of enthusiasm is dependent on what tawny is opened. 10's not so much, 20 seems to be the sweet spot, due to taste/value ratio, 30+ taste notes are mostly WOW, price, well OMG. 50+ only opened for people who will appreciate it. That leaves a special mention for White Port. It has become our new favorite type of Port. After having DR white and then later visiting DR, well that cemented things. The DR 30 white is one of the finest Ports I have ever tasted. You have someone over who hates port? Give them a good White wood aged. New Port lover born.

[John M.]

Interesting topic because we have migrated our Port drinking and buying.

The cellar contains: 75% VP, no additions planned as at our current consumption, the VP's will outlast me. No new additions planned.
25% Wood aged Port. These Ports are now 75% of our consumption and are purchased on a regular basis.

We still love VP, but it is a bit to open and serve. Many of our guests won't drink it except to taste. When we open a tawny(or Colheita), it's pop n pour! Our guests are more eager to taste, try, drink and then ask where can we get some of this? The amount of enthusiasm is dependent on what tawny is opened. 10's not so much, 20 seems to be the sweet spot, due to taste/value ratio, 30+ taste notes are mostly WOW, price, well OMG. 50+ only opened for people who will appreciate it. That leaves a special mention for White Port. It has become our new favorite type of Port. After having DR white and then later visiting DR, well that cemented things. The DR 30 white is one of the finest Ports I have ever tasted. You have someone over who hates port? Give them a good White wood aged. New Port lover born.

100% on White Port---I've yet to open any 10 or older that was not gloriously received by friends/guests.

[Alan Gardner]

Echoing Edward J here in terms of drinking.

This means a very high % (~95) of the cellar are Vintage Ports (as the wood-aged have been consumed).
I also favor the 20-year-old tawnies as the preferred balance of cost and enjoyment.

But the bottle size is also a major variable for me. Essentially, I only (?mostly) bought in half bottles, starting with the 1990's. Occasionally a few 750ml to compare as they aged. And everything from the 90's in halves still has time to go (IMO) - although some probably won't develop further.
By bottle count I'm at about 50% half-bottles (so maybe 30% by volume).