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What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:27 am
by Eric Menchen
From the Zachy's catalog for their 3 Dec 10 auction in NYC, p. 152:
If there is one wine more than any other that is inextricably linked to England it is Port. While many of the Port shippers have their origins in the seventeenth century, [it] is hard to establish exactly when, or why, Port began to be fortified. Certainly by the early 1700s it was something that resembled the Ports we enjoy today, and it was shipped out of Portugal in enormous quantities.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 2:04 pm
by Roy Hersh
Er, the latter part of his statement is off by a century!
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 2:48 pm
by Derek T.
Thomas McMullen's [i]Hand-book of Wines[/i], published in 1852, wrote:In 1689 ... the Oporto wines were free from any admixture of brandy ... The practice of using brandy commenced in the year 1720, and became very prevalent in the year 1754.
Having read many books from the 19th century it appears to be that the brandy added to the wines made in the 18th century and first half of the 19th century were predominantly added after the wines were fully fermented and brought to VNG/Oporto. I haven't yet found any definative proof of when the practice of using brandy to stop fermentation began.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:25 pm
by Eric Menchen
I didn't want to come out at first and state my objections, but you both have it. I thought we could state with some accuracy when the first fortification took place, and certainly why. And yes, the first fortification wasn't to stop fermentation, so the Port back then wasn't like the Port as we know it today. As for when fortification to stop fermentation and thus produce a sweet wine happened, here's what I found on the
IVDP web site:
In 1820, a new method for adding brandy the so-called modern winemaking technique was applied whereby brandy was added to stop fermentation, thus creating a sweeter wine in the mouth. This method only became widespread in 1852 when the Ports began to take on the characteristics of the Port Wines we know today.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:38 pm
by Andy Velebil
I too have never read or heard any definitive proof as to when brandy was added to stop the fermentation. But from what I've been told, read, and gathered around 1815 was when the practice started. So the IVDP's date of 1820 is probably pretty close. And I'm sure it took farmers some time to change their old ways of wine making!
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:20 pm
by Michael Hann
Richard Mayson speaks of James Joseph Forrester, a famed English shipper of the early to mid 19th century, champaigning against the use of brandy to fortify port. It would seem that the practice was known at that time but not consistently adopted by everyone, otherwise it would seem to have been outlandish of Forrester to champaign against the practice.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:24 pm
by Eric Menchen
I thought Forrester was against fortification to make sweet Port, the new fad style of the 1800s, not against fortification altogether.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 9:54 am
by Michael Hann
Eric Menchen wrote:I thought Forrester was against fortification to make sweet Port, the new fad style of the 1800s, not against fortification altogether.
You are probably correct. I think I may have misinterpreted or oversimplified your question. I was suggesting that Port as we know it today was NOT prevalent, if even known at all, by the early-1700s. Port that is not distinctly sweet due to fermentation being halted by fortification would not be Port as we know it today. I suppose the "distinctly sweet" characterization could be challenged, but comparing to other red wine fermentations that ferment out pretty much all the available sugars it seems a fairly accurate statement.
Of course, even what is meant by "ressembles Port of today" is ambiguous. Does this mean a wine of relatively high alcoholic strength? Maybe that is a fair statement. Does this mean a red wine produced from many of the same grapes used today? That is probably a fair statement. Does this mean a red wine that may be blended in some of the same ways Port is blended today? I don't know enough to answer that question. Does this mean that tawny Ports were made in a manner similar to that of today? Again, I don't know enough to answer that question.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 8:50 pm
by Eric Menchen
Michael Hann wrote:I was suggesting that Port as we know it today was NOT prevalent, if even known at all, by the early-1700s. Port that is not distinctly sweet due to fermentation being halted by fortification would not be Port as we know it today. ...
I agree with your characterization and interpretation.
Re: What do you think of these statements?
Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2010 12:32 pm
by Roy Hersh
For many years and long before the IVDP website even existed, I've been including the date as 1820 as a generalization of when the modern Port style (Vintage) began as we know it today.