Greatest ageing potential?

Justin Willott · Post by **Justin Willott** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:51 am

Taylors 77 is a VP which is often quoted as still young and destined for a long life ahead. Which VPs (1960-1990) do you think have the greatest ageing potential and would be a good buy for LONG term drinking?

Stuart Chatfield · Post by **Stuart Chatfield** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:29 am

I'd go for another pair of 77s - Smith Woodhouse or Gould Campbell. I think these two are remarkable. I've tasted them many times and would fill a cellar with them if I had the space and money. They're both good value - less than half the price of Taylor's.

For some reason both of these second-division wines from Symington look and taste so young. GC, especially, has been almost opaque and purple to the rim every time I've had it - 25 years after bottling. It looks like a '91 or '92. My only fear is that some of the negative aspects of ageing might overtake the onset of the more desirable parts of the ageing process. Maybe the fruit will dry out before the tannins soften. Sometimes it tastes just like a young (but good) LBV.

Personally I favour the SW as, although more advanced than the GC, it is still very young but starting to soften and gain that unmistakable ethereal quality of a top mature port. I think SW will be a legend at 50 years. I know other tastings by more knowledgeable people than me have concluded the same.

Frederick Blais · Post by **Frederick Blais** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:31 am

From what I've tasted so far, I think the 70 VP will hold longer than the 77. The Taylor 70 has such a backbone right now, not a baby but still presenting primary flavors of fruits.

Tom Archer · Post by **Tom Archer** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 3:22 pm

Looking at the question to establish which of the recent wines will develop into very ageworthy classics, it is worth noting that some of the single quinta's have been making some very small production runs from the best vines on their estates.

Some of these wines will doubtless become sought after gems in the future, but it may be a few years before they shine.

Looking at the question from another angle, and asking "which is the oldest vintage that is more likely than not to noticeably improve with further ageing" - I am inclined to the view that this is the better '70's, although some '66's may have a way to go.

Recent notes suggest that the '63's have probably peaked, and the '55's seem to be enjoying a long plateau.

Post by **Roy Hersh** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 1:20 am

The requests for lists of this or that can go on and on. I have seen this on other BBs too.

Instead, maybe ask a less generalized question that one can really answer in detail.

Something like:

What are your top 2 or 3 favorites Ports from the xxxx vintage?

That allows real dialogue and a variety of opinions to be expressed.

But to be a good sport ... and off the top of the head

1963 Nacional and Fonseca
1966 ditto
1967 Nacional
1970 Fonseca, Niepoort, Taylor, Dow
1977 Gould Campbell, Fonseca, Smith Woodhouse, Dow, Taylor
1980 Dow and Graham
1985 Graham, Burmester and Fonseca
1987 Quinta de Vargellas and Malvedos
1991 Croft ... yeah I know I am going over by one year

Stuart Chatfield · Post by **Stuart Chatfield** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 3:34 am

I'd say (only where I've tried most producers, several times):

60: Graham, Dow
63: not really tried enough to give a fair view - too over-priced
66: Dow, Dow, Dow - maybe an all-time favourite
70: Fonseca (variable, but at its best sublime), Warre (consistent, regardless of bottler)
75: Taylor
77: Taylor, GC, SW
80: Dow
83: have not tried enough to say
85: Taylor

Justin Willott · Post by **Justin Willott** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 6:43 am

Thanks for all this info. I had read that the 70s are generally likely to outlast the 77s and that no subsequent vintages are likely to have comparable longevity until the 94s.

I agree that "what are the best wines from each vintage" type questions are frequently asked and remember that there was a "what are the best VPs from each vintage" question on the Mark Squires BB early this year to which Roy (amongst others) gave a comprehensive list.

I was more interested in which one wine from this 30 year span is likely to live the longest and the Taylors 70 sounds pretty good. Looking forward to tasting it at the upcoming London offline.

Al B. · Post by **Al B.** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:58 am

My input to this debate - and if I have to choose only one wine from this period - would be the Nacional 1963. From all I have heard and read, this wine should go on and on.

While one or two people have told me that they have a bottle, no-one was willing to bring it with them on November 6th

The only Nacional I possess is the 1987, which I haven't tried yet.

One day I will try the Nacional '63, but that won't be soon.

Alex

Frederick Blais · Post by **Frederick Blais** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 9:07 am

Alex, get yourself hired to tread the grapes at Noval. This year there was a group of British journalist that went up there to tread some grapes with the team and as a reward they were able to taste the 1963 8)

I also own a 1987 as they cost way much less than the pre 1980 and post 1990. 1987 is very well acclaimed by Broadbent. 1983 not reviewed by Broadbent but having the best QPR mark from Roy tasting last year is also a great choice. I may give it a try this year for my birthday if I can still buy a few more at the Noval wine shop if Roy's group don't buy them all