A tough Port question

[Roy Hersh]

NEWS:

I've been told that the IVDP is going to legislate against production of Garrafeira Ports in the near future. Obviously Dirk Niepoort is the only one producing them.

Does anybody know WHY this is happening?

And ... if so, when?

[Derek T.]

I do not know why or when, but I know that Dirk is not the only one producing them!

[Roy Hersh]

That would be news to him. So who else is doing so?

[Derek T.]

I have a picture of a demijohn that is sitting in the Cockburn cellar in VNG. It is their second vintage to be produced in this style but neither are intended for commercial release so I suppose, technically, it doesn't count. I think the picture is alread in PORTraits.

[João Rico]

I think that's not completely true as i just talked about that last weekend with Dirk.
A few time ago there were some movements to end the designation Garrafeira. This movement was held by a port producer. Anyway, the previous President of IVDP Jorge Monteiro, called Dirk and signed the permission to maintaining the Garrafeira and even shorted the cellaring time in the demijohns.

BTW does anyone know what will be the next vintage of a Garrafeira after the 77 that will be released 2010/11?

[Derek T.]

BTW does anyone know what will be the next vintage of a Garrafeira after the 77 that will be released 2010/11?

I can't remember which vintage it is but I seen the bottles all racked up and ready to ship in cages when I was at their lodge last year. Is it 1983?

[João Rico]

Is it 1983?

Nope

[Roy Hersh]

No idea. He had been talking about releasing the 1977 for several years and I am waiting to see that happen, at least I know it hasn't here in the USA and was not the case anywhere, as of May 2008. Has the '77 finally hit the marketplace Joao?

Outside of Dirk's disciple, FB here ... I don't know anyone else that will KNOW the answer to your question. We'll be patient and hope you'll let us know the answer though, at some point when you deem it proper to do so.

[Shawn Denkler]

It is in the interest of the port trade to have the public understand port and the styles of port. Since Niepoort is basically the only producer of the Garrafeira, that style should be eliminated have one less style of port. Then it is easier for the public to understand the Colheita style and have no confusion with Garrafeira.

The German wine trade has been held back greatly because of the complexity of their styles (and too many vineyards when only some are of high enough quality to designate on a label). Simplification would help the sales of German wine.

I believe this is the reason the IVDP is going to legislate against production of Garrafeira Ports - simplification.

I am a big fan of Niepoort's ports, and personally would be very disappointed if Garrafeira is banned. But Neipoort is a small house and may be able to call them Colheitas and explain the difference to their customers. But maybe not. I am not sure if they spent enough time in barrel to be called Colheita. Would demijohn aging qualify toward Colheita designation under IVDP rules?

[Andy Velebil]

Shawn,
I agree with you about German wine labels being the most confusing thing in wine. Some have gold capsules that mean something, some gold capsules don't. Some have stars on the capsules that mean something, some have stars that don't. And lets not even get into trying to read and understand the labels, holy cow! Yes something should be done there as they are so confusing, even for people that drink them regularly. But eliminating one particular style of Port only because one company currently sells them at retail is plain ludicrous. So what happens when another small producers wants to make or release one? It does no harm to leave it alone and allow them to be produced. Besides lets be honest here, even most Port drinkers have never even heard about this particular type of port before, much less tried one. So there really is no confusion as there is so little of them available that most people have not and will not ever try one. Garrafeira is really only known to us Port nerds and those in the Port trade. Its kinda like Crusted Ports, not many people produce them now-a-days but we don't ban them simply because they might confuse people and so few companys produce them.

[João Rico]

NEWS:

I've been told that the IVDP is going to legislate against production of Garrafeira Ports in the near future. Obviously Dirk Niepoort is the only one producing them.

Does anybody know WHY this is happening?

And ... if so, when?

I writed that already had been development towards the ending of designation Garrafeira, at that time the President of IVDP, Jorge Monteiro, granted the live of the Garrafeiras.
But now we have a new President, so those who were against in the past, can charge again. It would be a pitty to loose that kind of port.

The Garrafeira 1977 is now bottled but there is the next Garrafeira already in demijohns. It will be the 1987 but i don't know when it will be released.

Does anybody know WHY this is happening?

A lot of things happens in Port by "misterious" ways and there are some lobbys in Port too. IMHO, the probable cause can be the fact that only one small company has the possibility of doing Garrafeira, only one small company had allways the courage to spend a lot in cellaring these wines for so long. I guess some can be a little jealous and try to end this.

[Tom Archer]

The Garrafeira is a curious variety of port, with a production level so small as to make it effectively insignificant. If someone is taking the trouble to try to outlaw it, then I can only assume tht Dirk has upset someone along the way..

If there is a product that needs clarification, then it is the Colheita, as the great bulk of non-Portuguese port drinkers have not got a clue what it is, and are wholly unable to distinguish the good from the bad (and the ugly..)

An approved alternate name - maybe Single Tawny - and fixed periods for bottling - so valid comparisons can be made - would greatly boost sales.

Tom

[Andy Velebil]

If there is a product that needs clarification, then it is the Colheita, as the great bulk of non-Portuguese port drinkers have not got a clue what it is, and are wholly unable to distinguish the good from the bad (and the ugly..)

Tom,
It's really only the UK that has no idea what they are. The rest of the world has already figured it out :devil: Seriously though, what amazes me is how much VP the UK drinks, but how little Colheita's they drink or can even find to buy. Then I look at what producers make them and that explains a lot. As almost all the colheita produced comes from the non-British producers. So why you guys got us beat on the ruby port consumption, the rest of the world has the UK beat when it comes to Colheita drinking and the resulting knowledge. It's time you come out here to the states for some prime Colheita drinking experience...L.A. is the perfect place too

[Glenn E.]

If you saddle Colheita with a name like "Single Tawny" you won't help sales, you'll hurt them. Colheita is as related to basic Tawny Port as Vintage Port is related to basic Rubies. And you don't see people trying to get VP renamed "Single Ruby" do you?

The proper direction is education. Colheita, not VP, is the rarest form of Port and it should be exhalted as such. (According to Mayson, 1% of sales by volume vs 2% for VP.) One simple sentence in the store and the problem is solved: "'Colheita' is the Portuguese word for 'harvest' or 'vintage', and this style of Port is the tawny equivalent of Vintage Port."

But Andy is right - over here in the US, people seem to know about as much about Colheita as they do about VP. My guess is that the shippers are probably content at the current level of sales because Colheita requires so much cellaring. They probably don't really have room for more in their cellars, and so don't really want to dramatically increase demand. After all, the Portuguese prefer tawnies... what will they drink if the rest of the world catches on?

[Frederick Blais]

Bah, jumping a bit late in the topic.... If the 77 will be released in 2011, we could assume that the 1987 will be released somewhere near 2021. I've tasted the 1987 Garrafeira 2 times already. Dirk did bottle a few just to test the evolution. It is great, one night, it was served side by side with the 1987 VP. If you would say that VP is Bordeaux, then Garrafeira is definitively Burgundy.

Now, for the Garrafeira legislation... IVDP sometimes takes weird decision, like look at the niew Niepoort Bottles, they had to add the word Port on the side of their bottles because the brand Niepoort was too big compared to the word Port above. Can you believe that Niepoort got some Colheita years rejected? Then there are the lobiying... some Port companies would even like to see the Colheita category disapear, as crazy as it could sound.

At the moment, there is a nice David and Goliath fight in the Douro. The Symington's and Taylor crying that it is impossible to make viable business in the Douro if you don't do volume or collection of companies to reduce cost, while small producer like the Douro boys are all achieving this. I'm not sure the English establishement are that much please with the current situation.

[Tom Archer]

It's really only the UK that has no idea what they are. The rest of the world has already figured it out

Actually Andy, if you check the IVDP data, you will find that more Colheita is consumed per capita in the UK than in the USA, but in both cases the stats are utterly pathetic - only the Dutch have gained any significant appreciation of the product, consuming more than the US, UK and Portugal put together!

The widespread marketing of Single Malt whisky by Glenfiddich was ridiculed at the outset when they launched their product (which was pretty poor..), yet it is now a huge moneyspinner for all the distillers.

For Colheitas to succeed in the marketplace, they need to have a name that is immediately understood in English, and a product structure that allows critics to compare like wines, and compose reviews.

The standalone nature of Colheitas, and the uncertainty over the pronounciation of the name, results in their being virtually no press attention to the products.

- That is not good for business!

Tom

[Andy Velebil]

ctually Andy, if you check the IVDP data, you will find that more Colheita is consumed per capita in the UK than in the USA,

I've checked the IVDP's listed data and they don't break it down by individual colheita sales. Can you provide numbers please. And I know we've had this discussion before and everyone from the UK has stated the they rarely can find and almost never drink Colheita's. The UK has never been a prime location for colheita sales, ruby Ports have ruled the land. Remember we're talking just Colheita's, not basic tawny's.

For Colheitas to succeed in the marketplace, they need to have a name that is immediately understood in English, and a product structure that allows critics to compare like wines, and compose reviews.

The standalone nature of Colheitas, and the uncertainty over the pronounciation of the name, results in their being virtually no press attention to the products.

I think it is understood by the majority of Port drinkers. It's not hard to learn that colheita means the grapes are from one vintage only. Yes, a little bit of education is in order, but that's no different than learning what a late harvest zinfandel is or a meritage is. If people can figure out German wine labels and buy lots, it ain't that hard to figure out what colheita means...but again, it just comes down to a little bit of education.

I agree the press coverage of ALL Port is dismal at best, sans here. At best you can get reviews from major publications only in the major delcared years. Very rarely do they review Ports outside of that. I can't recall the last time I've seen a review of basic Ports. Matter of fact I just checked a couple leading world wide publications, Wine Spectator and Wine Advocate, and here is what I've found....

(producer and date reviewed - month/year)
Wine Spectator
NIepoort Tawny Port Colheita 1983 01/1996
Barros Tawny Port 20 Year Old 02/1990
Burmester Tawny Port 20 Year Old 02/1990
Niepoort Tawny Port 10 Year Old 09/2003
Cockburn Tawny Port 20 Year Old 09/2003
São Pedro Tawny Port 10 Year Old 09/1997
Cálem Tawny Port Old Friends 08/2001

After searching through 5 pages of listings it was apparent they did 3 major reviews, 01/1996, 02/1990, and 09/2003. Thats pretty pathetic for reviewing tawny's and colheita's...and there wasn't that many colheita reviews at WS, mostly tawny's with an indication of age with a handful of basic tawnys. They had only 7 reviews of Colheita Ports.

For Wine Advocate...

8 reviews for colheita's...all but one were Quinta do Noval Colheita's (and one from Quinta do Portal)
For tawny's..and they were all tawny's with an indication of age except for one Churchill tawny, the total was 12. And they were either Taylors, Fonseca, Noval, and one (1) review each Offley, Calem, and Ferreira.

So for two major wine publications that is quite pathetic for reviews. Between them, in the past 20 years, they have only reviewed 19 colheita's! :help:

[Glenn E.]

For Colheitas to succeed in the marketplace, they need to have a name that is immediately understood in English, and a product structure that allows critics to compare like wines, and compose reviews.

You mean like Spaetlese, Auslese, Champagne, and all those other foreign words related to wine that we already understand? Modern Port labels are FAR easier to understand than French or German wine labels.

We don't need a name change, we need education. If you change the name you have to educate the entire world about the change. If you don't change the name you only have to educate those who don't already understand, and that is a much easier task. Part of the problem is that Port ages so well that a significant part of the market is for Port that was bottled before the modern label regulations were in place. Changing the labels again will only add to that confusion.

The Port trade needs to promote its products better, it's as simple as that.

[Derek T.]

Andy/Glenn,

There are a few factors that you are missing here.

Fitrstly, as a sweeping generalisation, the vast majority of the British middle and upper classes are more than likely of the view that Port is a British thing. It just happens to be produced (by ex-pat Brits) in one of the last outposts of the Empire. Port sales the UK supermarkets, by far the greatest volume sellers here, are almost exclusively ports with British names on the label. Cockburn, Graham, Taylor, Warre and Dow would probably account fro 90%+ of the volume sales through these outlets. Fonseca, Noval and BOBs making up at least 9% of the rest. The overwhelming majority of British port drinkers, and I am not talking about those who spend significant amounts of their time talking about it on the internet, will never have tasted a port with a non-British name on the label.

A second factor is that the British producers do not produce Colheita in any great volume and certainly do not market it here. I think I can safely say that I have never seen a bottle of Colheita in a uK supermarket or chain wine merchant. Specialist, independant wine merchants are a different story, but they are a miniscule part of the picture in terms of volume and even they very rarely stock a significant range of Colheita.

Lastly, but by no means least, it is regretful that the inhabitants of this little island do not have much capacity or appetite for embracing foreign languages. There are words that are now in common use and have to a large extent become part of our own vocabulary (Champagne for instance) but we make little or no attempt to learn anything new unless it is foisted upon us by mass marketing. Coffee is an example of this. If Costa, Starbucks and their like had not appeared on every street corner in the past 10 years us Brits would still only know of 2 styles of coffee. White and black :help: - Most of us can now order a Latte or a Mocha and have at least some idea of what we will get. However, an "Americano" is still confusing - because posh coffee comes from Italy and France - doesn't it? :twisted:

I agree with your view that Colheita doesn't need a new name to grow a significant market share on your side of the pond. I just don't think it will happen here, even with a change of name. Possibly because the British taste is for ruby rather than tawny ports?

Derek

[Andy Velebil]

Derek,
I got the point and what you stated verified what I wrote. Tom stated that the UK consumes more than the US...his quote

more Colheita is consumed per capita in the UK than in the USA

Yet I know from talking to you and other Brit's (sorry, and Scot's ) that Colheita's are very rare in the UK so I know that isn't true. Where as the rest of the Port drinking world can find them much easier and consumes more of them. As you and I both pointed out the British producers don't make much in the way of Colheita's. Thus one of their major markets, the UK, doesn't get much of them which is a real shame. But I guess us Yanks gotta beat you guys on at least one thing