The basics of Port Wine Lodges

[Roy Hersh]

There are several dozen Port wine lodges in Vila Nova de Gaia. Last year, I finally achieved a goal by having visited every one available to the public or by appointment. There are so many different experiences, actually they vary widely in quality and what they offer a tourist off the street, or a serious enthusiast who takes the time to make an appointment. What do you think makes one better than the next, as there are so many dynamics that come into play.

Also, what are some of the best and worst experiences you have had personally, while visiting Gaia's Port lodges?

[Paul Fountain]

I'd like to see more lodges adopt the tiered structure that Grahams use where they provide the opportunity to taste at different levels. Many that go to the lodges are there to tick off an activity on their tourist todo list and are more interested that you can get free alcohol rather than look at the quality of the wines available, so I'm happy to pay a bit to get the opportunity to try the good stuff.

[Tom Archer]

What do you think makes one better than the next

It all depends who the visitor is - most handle the massed hordes of non wine-specific tour groups pretty well.

Handling of serious wine-buffs is much more variable though - these can be pretty high spenders in the lodges, and quite lucrative for the producers, provided they get the hospitality right.

Too many lodge guides read from a basic script, and have insufficient knowledge to impress a wine afficionado, especially if they've just been to two other lodges, and have heard exactly the same spiel.

A prime concern for all the lodges is to have staff who are fluent in a variety of different languages, but it makes all the difference when the staff are also passionate about the product, and can convey their enthusiasm to the visitors..

[Moses Botbol]

The best I visited were Andresen and Graham. Both were fantastic hosts and poured rare and great port. The tour part was also fascinating and both were quite different.

The worst lodge I visited was Niepoort. It was health hazard moldy and they served the absolute bottom barrel port considering the audience. I really felt let down considering how excited was to see their lodge.

Sogevinus has a real first class facility for both the tour and for tasting. I also like the trendy look of Dalva. Is it a couture salon or tasting room? Taking port tasting in a hip novel direction.

[Tom Archer]

The worst lodge I visited was Niepoort. It was health hazard moldy and they served the absolute bottom barrel port considering the audience. I really felt let down considering how excited was to see their lodge.

Dirk's dungeon is a classic, and the stairs present a good sobriety test..

- What were you served?

[Moses Botbol]

Dirk's dungeon is a classic, and the stairs present a good sobriety test..

- What were you served?

We were served Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum, along with an LBV.

[Tom Archer]

Most of the lodges have a 'regular' hospitality package that only embraces standard ports, with the staff having authority to add something a little better (such as an LBV or 10yr) - if they think the visitors merit it.

Clearly you had reason to expect a 'special' hospitality reception at Niepoort, but for some reason only got the 'regular' package - with a little icing on top!

[Andy Velebil]

The worst lodge I visited was Niepoort. It was health hazard moldy and they served the absolute bottom barrel port considering the audience. I really felt let down considering how excited was to see their lodge.

Dirk's dungeon is a classic, and the stairs present a good sobriety test..

- What were you served?

Tom
Not only the stairs, but the lighting as well. But it is one of the coolest cellars to have a tasting in. With the medieval-like chairs and tables, darker lighting, cool damp feeling, how can you go wrong. It is a cellar after all.

[Moses Botbol]

But it is one of the coolest cellars to have a tasting in. With the medieval-like chairs and tables, darker lighting, cool damp feeling, how can you go wrong. It is a cellar after all.

For sure it had a cool "Interview with a Vampire" look to it and seeing all the bottles stacked up was a hoot.

[Roy Hersh]

Perspective is everything, and there are some unique ones posted in this thread.

[Tom Archer]

Perspective is everything

Especially when the host is on a roll - as Dirk was last Friday..

..how many bottles opened? - I didn't count, but at least twenty come to mind, most of them vintage..

- no-one does hospitality better!

[Roy Hersh]

Agree with Tom's earler post, of the importance of the quality of the staffing.

Yes, "multi-lingual" may just be the second most important quality when hiring someone to entertain guests at the lodge, especially at a tasting bar for Port. However, understanding is one thing and being able to deliver the passion for Port is another. Knowledge can be improved by quality training of new staffers and continued education, which some companies have in place. What can't be taught is sincerity and friendliness and those two qualities are more important for a "guide" or "lodge bar staffer" than even speaking many languages.

Think of us as a subset group of visitors to a lodge. We are probably in the 5% of the people that would be the most serious of Port geeks. I say that with all due respect. But there is probably 70+% of the guests that have little to no knowledge about Port, whatsoever and either are just looking to catch a buzz, or possibly to learn some of the basics of the categories. They surely don't know a thing about the Douro, have no idea about its quintas or the three sub-regions, etc. That is understandable. Moving them into the next subset should be the challenge of all lodge employees.

The 20% that fall between those masses and us, the "uber-geeks" ... have intentionally chosen Porto to visit in order to broaden their horizons about Port. They may have been to the Douro in the past; drink Port 3-10x a year and own a small cache of bottles too. That is the group that needs to have someone more attentive at the bar, and the staff should be empowered to determine if they should get to taste something better than a 10 year old Tawny or something older than a 2000 Vintage Port, per se. Offsetting the cost of this by charging 5 Euros pp when someone sits down would not offend anyone and if so, let them go elsewhere. I am not saying that the Port shippers in Gaia should definitively charge all clients for the tasting, but it would certainly discourage some who are just looking at Port for a good afternoon buzz before hitting up the next free place to drink. I think a great way to make this even cooler for those who are there to sincerely learn is to put the tasting fee towards ANY purchase at the lodge, whether that is a hat or a tee shirt, or bottles of Port. That way, the upfront tasting fee could serve to rid the lodge of those there to take advantage and those that are there to learn something while there.

Just my two cents.

[Andy Velebil]

The 20% that fall between those masses and us, the "uber-geeks" ... have intentionally chosen Porto to visit in order to broaden their horizons about Port. They may have been to the Douro in the past; drink Port 3-10x a year and own a small cache of bottles too. That is the group that needs to have someone more attentive at the bar, and the staff should be empowered to determine if they should get to taste something better than a 10 year old Tawny or something older than a 2000 Vintage Port, per se. Offsetting the cost of this by charging 5 Euros pp when someone sits down would not offend anyone and if so, let them go elsewhere. I am not saying that the Port shippers in Gaia should definitively charge all clients for the tasting, but it would certainly discourage some who are just looking at Port for a good afternoon buzz before hitting up the next free place to drink. I think a great way to make this even cooler for those who are there to sincerely learn is to put the tasting fee towards ANY purchase at the lodge, whether that is a hat or a tee shirt, or bottles of Port. That way, the upfront tasting fee could serve to rid the lodge of those there to take advantage and those that are there to learn something while there.

Just my two cents.

agree and this reminds me of tasting in Napa a number of years ago. Me and a friend rolled into a public tasting room, plopped down our tasting note books, then asked for spit cups. This last thing raised some eyebrows. After looking and finally finding some, we proceeded with the basic tasting. After spitting and writing tasting notes, then talking a little with the employee he obviously realized we weren't there to get drunk for free but were serious wine people. Then he starts pulling the special bottles out from under the bar. That was a well trained employee who quickly was able to identify we were not the typical tourist just looking for a free drink. We bought some things after and headed out with a very positive experience that has translated into me buying bottles from them to this day.

[Roy Hersh]

Yes, the importance of spitting. I am going to have to do a thread on that.